Curse

felinette · May 03, 2006, 05:13 PM // 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Studio Ghibli

I say this because I work in a large corporation, I understand how one tiny thing can make everything go wrong

And when it does go wrong, you come up with a solution that will allow your customers to use your product in a timely manner. What these people need are keys. They don't need all the extra crap right now. Yes, things go wrong. What separates the good companies from the bad ones is how the company responds when they go wrong. Telling customers that they'll just have to wait, while everyone else enjoys the game, is a less than stellar response to the situation.

Joiya Byir · May 03, 2006, 05:20 PM // 17:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

I honestly can't believe people thought the "Head Start" would last 10 days!

I believed the "Head Start" will be extended for those who preordered after it was clear keys are late. It's not my fault they sold some cheap keys and now are shaken by the possibility of people rolling their "epic storyline" in two days and be gone then.

Studio Ghibli · May 03, 2006, 05:23 PM // 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by felinette

And when it does go wrong, you come up with a solution that will allow your customers to use your product in a timely manner. What these people need are keys. They don't need all the extra crap right now. Yes, things go wrong. What separates the good companies from the bad ones is how the company responds when they go wrong. Telling customers that they'll just have to wait, while everyone else enjoys the game, is a less than stellar response to the situation.

I actually work with shipping and receiving at my Best Buy--so, assuming Gaile was being honest (and I have no reason to believe she's a liar) in saying that the problem was distribution, I can totally understand how something like this can be snafued.

One guy can really screw it up for a whole bunch of people, as well as a thousand-dollar transacation.

We do our best to remedy the situation. Sometimes, we'll bend over backwards, but this depends on the circumstances. Normally, all we can do is apologize, say we're on it, and press a button--because that's all that needed to be done in the first place.

As for what ArenaNet is doing, the problem is supply and distribution. They've already said they have a second release for May 5th and a third release sometime in June. I think they're doing all they can do right now, short of, say, letting us all play for free, and.. as much as I'd like that, I don't think that's a good idea.

So, your suggestion is keys?

Are you suggesting that Anet create a system in which keys can be sold on their website--and then, at a later date, the CE belonging to that key would be shipped to the proper address?

Being that this sytem isn't even in place at the moment, they'd have to create said system, tweak it, test it--not only the internet protocol, but also a system of distribution for this particular procedure (it obviously isn't in-house), as well as a method of linking the purchased key to the purchased CE..

.. or we could all wait for the May 5th release of the CE?

It's already been reported that Best Buy's have shipments marked for delivery. They're not -in- delivery. They've simply been allocated for shipment.

Mordakai · May 03, 2006, 05:28 PM // 17:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joiya Byir

I believed the "Head Start" will be extended for those who preordered after it was clear keys are late. It's not my fault they sold some cheap keys and now are shaken by the possibility of people rolling their "epic storyline" in two days and be gone then.

It was extended! By three days! Honestly, people, Anet has gone above and beyond.

Now, if Chapter 3 gets screwed up as well...

(BTW, I've already decided to buy the chapter 3 CE to make up for missing this one. I expect that it will go much smoother...)

felinette · May 03, 2006, 05:34 PM // 17:34

Quote:

One guy can really screw it up for a whole bunch of people, as well as a thousand-dollar transacation.

Yes, we've all acknowledged that things can go wrong. That's not the issue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Studio Ghibli

Are you suggesting that Anet create a system in which keys can be sold on their website--and then, at a later date, the CE belonging to that key would be shipped to the proper address?

No, I'm suggesting that there had to be a better response than, "Just wait." There are various ways they could have allowed people to continue playing. For example, the ten-day grace period would have worked just fine if it was indeed a ten-day grace period that allowed you to continue playing Factions.

Again, it's not the fact that something went wrong, but the response when it did.

twicky_kid · May 03, 2006, 05:46 PM // 17:46

Registration of a GW store would solve all the systems problems of matching keys to orders. You go to site and register with your information. Pick the things you want to buy. Pay with credit/debit card or checking info (routing # and bank account #). The key will be sent to the email address that was registered on their site.

This is a very simply system to install and run. Most of the management is done automaticly and can be just overseen.

I'm not going to make excuses for Anet this time. The retailers did request special codes to let their customers keep playing. The agreement to accept the code by the consumer would be a non refundable, transferable, or cannot cancel agreement. If you accept the code you MUST pay for your copy of the game upfront and cannot cancel the order later.

Anet refused to give those retailers any kind of help or support for their customers. Not only did Anet cost themselves money they made other companies lose large amounts of money. Don't think that retailers are very happy with Anet and probly will not be buying the game in large quantities like they may of done before.

Oh yeah, big corporations FEAR the word of mouth. They would much rather throw you a bone to prevent you slandering thier "good name." Spending Millions on advertisement to have 1 person tell 10-20 other people that its not a good idea is exactly what companies do not want.

Mordakai · May 03, 2006, 05:52 PM // 17:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

I'm not going to make excuses for Anet this time. The retailers did request special codes to let their customers keep playing. The agreement to accept the code by the consumer would be a non refundable, transferable, or cannot cancel agreement. If you accept the code you MUST pay for your copy of the game upfront and cannot cancel the order later.

Anet refused to give those retailers any kind of help or support for their customers. Not only did Anet cost themselves money they made other companies lose large amounts of money. Don't think that retailers are very happy with Anet and probly will not be buying the game in large quantities like they may of done before.

Twicky, where did you hear all this?

I don't think Anet will have any problems selling out their CEs (except maybe the second run). The reg. ed. was almost sold out of EB Games...

Joiya Byir · May 03, 2006, 05:55 PM // 17:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

It was extended! By three days! Honestly, people, Anet has gone above and beyond.

The still have my money, Cantha is still locked and retail key is still missing. Can I have your key please, I'll give you mine when/if it arrives? k.tnx.bye.

twicky_kid · May 03, 2006, 05:59 PM // 17:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

Twicky, where did you hear all this?

I don't think Anet will have any problems selling out their CEs (except maybe the second run). The reg. ed. was almost sold out of EB Games...

I talked to a Manger Rep from the customer support department for my retailer. I myself being a customer rep I know how to work the system to find information. They disclosed that they have requested special keys to let the retailers customer's to keep playing until the CE could be sent and received.

Anet refused to disclose the keys or give any kind of support in that kind of manner.

Studio Ghibli · May 03, 2006, 06:00 PM // 18:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

Registration of a GW store would solve all the systems problems of matching keys to orders. You go to site and register with your information. Pick the things you want to buy. Pay with credit/debit card or checking info (routing # and bank account #). The key will be sent to the email address that was registered on their site.

This is a very simply system to install and run. Most of the management is done automaticly and can be just overseen.

...

Oh yeah, big corporations FEAR the word of mouth. They would much rather throw you a bone to prevent you slandering thier "good name." Spending Millions on advertisement to have 1 person tell 10-20 other people that its not a good idea is exactly what companies do not want.

I didn't meant to suggest that a system for delivery was impossible or hard. Rather, I meant to say, given the current schedule of deliveries for the CE, it doesn't make sense to create a new system -right now- specifically for -this- CE problem, 'cause you'd have to create it, test it, implement it, and connect all the distribution wires.

Yes, it's a great idea, and I wouldn't mind seeing something like that used. Just, right now, the best that Anet can do is what they're doing right now.

As for your thoughts on "word of mouth," I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not.

As for a ten-day free trial, it's already been discussed. <-- this is for Felinette.

As for the issue of Anet and special keys, I remember people abused the shit out of DDO online when it was selling pre-order keys. Despite the no-cancellation agreement, people bypassed it because of something to do with a Visa checkcard?.. and how you could simply call your bank and have them stop payment on it and they would?.. don't really understand exactly how it worked, simply that it -was- working.

I'd also wager that the creation of special keys would again require a distribution network all of its own, not to mention the creation process for said keys. You'd have to have a little box, at the very least, some artwork on the box, the card for the box--and then the distribution.

Said materials, of course, would have to be shipped to wherever the items would be assembled.

Or we could all wait for the May 5th release--and, if we miss that, hopefully the June release will actually be closer than stated.

I have trouble enough having an order placed for a box or two of garbage bags, and the system for that is already in-place. Unless ArenaNet has a warehouse of empty boxes, artwork, cards pre-printed with special keys, I can see why Anet shot it down: the CE will probably be out by the time the special key boxes made it to the shelves.

And even then, one also has to consider that assembly of special key boxes would probably effect production of actual CEs.. ;P

Venomios · May 03, 2006, 06:07 PM // 18:07

Here is where they screwed up the most...

"Response (Ben) - 04/29/2006 04:13 AM
Hello [Venomios],

Thanks for the contacting us regarding your character issues.

We regret the inconvenience this has caused. If you do not activate your current game account with a Guild Wars Factions Access Key before the grace period is over, any Factions characters in temporary slots will be automatically deleted once the grace period is over. You will have the character slots available to you once you have applied a Guild Wars Factions Access Key to your game account.

If you have any further questions or concerns, please let us know.

Regards,
The Guild Wars Support Team"

Now, is there anywhere in that message that says, "Mr/Ms Customer, we feel for you, and these are the steps we're taking?" No. I've worked in retail for years. It's all about customer service. If you get an upset customer and just throw him out angry, it's true you'll never see him again, but you'll also lose his business and his friends' & family's too.

However, if you go the extra mile and create a solution for him, that may not be perfect, but satisfies most of the concerns, he will come back to you personally for all his future needs. It's not the product that sells a store or company in the long term, it's the care and level of customer service.

Same thing with Guild Wars. If GW didn't have the streaming updates that fixed things people in the forums complained about, and we were still playing GW 1.0, I bet you the game would have died by September of last year. But no, the customer service was excellent, and people acknowledged it.

Now with this Factions fiasco, the excellent in-game customer service is being offset by very poor out-of-came customer service. I know a few people that have quit already. One was a leader of his guild. After he quit the game, that guild fell apart, and several more have quit, which has ruined the fun for everyone in that guild. It's a domino effect. People remember the bad things MUCH longer than they remember the good things... ask any married man. His wife can tell you everything he did wrong over the last X years in detail, but when it comes to the good things, she'll just say "yeah, it was good, but it went so fast, I don't remember everything." Same deal here. This will have huge reprocussions on the GW Community.

Venomios · May 03, 2006, 06:14 PM // 18:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

I talked to a Manger Rep from the customer support department for my retailer. I myself being a customer rep I know how to work the system to find information. They disclosed that they have requested special keys to let the retailers customer's to keep playing until the CE could be sent and received.

Anet refused to disclose the keys or give any kind of support in that kind of manner.

I agree. I'm on good terms with the local Gamestop manager, and he read me a memo the managers were sent that said Gamestop was working on getting set of codes for their CE pre-orders, and that CE people just had to call the Gamestop service 800 line and they could get a key from them. I called the service number, and the tech there said that unfortunitely, NC Soft has refused to accommodate the request, and said that NC Soft would be shipping the CE on it's original schedule (which at that time was June 30th).

It was this response that prompted me to contact NC Soft, and get hosed, shafted, and treated more poorly than I would if I walked onto a porshe lot and asked the guy for a test drive.

Studio Ghibli · May 03, 2006, 06:14 PM // 18:14

What was your original e-mail to Anet's customer service?

- edit -

Also, if the suggested system was simply for Anet to provide a set of special keys to those who had already pre-ordered..

.. then I misunderstood Twicky.

I'm not entirely sure what would have been wrong with that system, besides the "let's cancel our order with our magical Visa checkard" thing--which is more or less the same issue Anet had with a ten-day headstart, that new folks unfamiliar with GW mechanics would race through everything in a WoW mindset, leave, and cancel their pre-order.

Mordakai · May 03, 2006, 06:16 PM // 18:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Venomios

Here is where they screwed up the most...

"Response (Ben) - 04/29/2006 04:13 AM
Hello [Venomios],

Thanks for the contacting us regarding your character issues.

We regret the inconvenience this has caused. If you do not activate your current game account with a Guild Wars Factions Access Key before the grace period is over, any Factions characters in temporary slots will be automatically deleted once the grace period is over. You will have the character slots available to you once you have applied a Guild Wars Factions Access Key to your game account.

If you have any further questions or concerns, please let us know.

Regards,
The Guild Wars Support Team"

Woah. That goes against everything I've heard from Gaile and others. I would write another letter, showing where Gaile said otherwise in game chatlogs, etc. This is the first time I've heard of them deleting slots...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joiya Byir

The still have my money, Cantha is still locked and retail key is still missing. Can I have your key please, I'll give you mine when/if it arrives? k.tnx.bye.

You never answered my question: Why did you pay in full for a game not in stock? I went and bought the reg edition on Sunday.

felinette · May 03, 2006, 06:20 PM // 18:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Studio Ghibli

Just, right now, the best that Anet can do is what they're doing right now.

I doubt it. There had to be a way they could have allowed those who had preordered CE's to continue playing. Would some players have abused it? Possibly. But most who ordered the CE are LOYAL customers who love GW and want to support the game. So sometimes you have to take a little bit of a hit to gain good will with a greater number of customers.

And again, I'm amazed at people who are just willing to sit there and wait for the CE. Hopefully it'll be this week, but what if it is June? Just cancel the CE and go get the SE. It's available TODAY.

twicky_kid · May 03, 2006, 06:31 PM // 18:31

Ghibli you are correct that a system like that could not be operational before the shipping dates that have been set to get us key codes. They could have at least givin some support to the retailers in retrospect to this problem.

My point is in the future if something is not like this in place I will be very doubtful about ordering another game.

Bottom line is Anet does not want to pay merchant fees for those credit/debit card transactions. That's why a system like that was on in place to begin with.

Mordakai · May 03, 2006, 06:32 PM // 18:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

Ghibli you are correct that a system like that could not be operational before the shipping dates that have been set to get us key codes. They could have at least givin some support to the retailers in retrospect to this problem.

My point is in the future if something is not like this in place I will be very doubtful about ordering another game.

Bottom line is Anet does not want to pay merchant fees for those credit/debit card transactions. That's why a system like that was on in place to begin with.

This crap won't happen again. I don't know what system Anet will come up with, but seeing the grief they've caused, they will know better.

At least, they'd better!

plasmasword · May 03, 2006, 06:34 PM // 18:34

The most exciting part of a game is the first few days of it. Everyone is exploring new areas, finding new greens left and right, figuring out the best way to do a mission, being to first to accomplish something ect...But with the people who pre-ordered CE, the 1 day head-start has turned into a 1 week late-start. They forced the people who were willing to put down 30 extra bucks for damn CE to miss out on all of the fun things that comes when a game is first released.

When the people that preordered CE start playing, everything will be discovered, people will be shouting spoilers in towns left and right, and we might become noobs because we do not know the proper way to do missions.

Studio Ghibli · May 03, 2006, 06:39 PM // 18:39

.. if it's June, I'm simply going to head with the SE.

It's frustrating to listen to my guildies explore Factions and all I can do is work toward my Tyria Protector badge, not because I want to, but because it's all I can do right now.

Twicky:

Here's hopin' they have a system like that, then. ;D

Joiya Byir · May 03, 2006, 06:40 PM // 18:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mordakai

You never answered my question: Why did you pay in full for a game not in stock? I went and bought the reg edition on Sunday.

Because this was the only offer from the local retailer. Judging by posts in this thread this was the (only?) offer in other contries too. I trusted them so I paid, as simple as that. And now they are shitting exactly on the people who showed a bit more support than the others.